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Foxy from Texas

Tell us a little about yourself, pets or whatever.

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Tim74
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Foxy from Texas

Postby Tim74 » Tue Jun 12, 2012 9:05 am

Hello looking for help here. In the next few weeks I will be buying 2 arctic foxes. They will have their own room and should be quit comfortable. Any advice regarding arctic foxes is welcome. Thanks
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Alynn
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Re: Foxy from Texas

Postby Alynn » Tue Jun 12, 2012 9:30 am

It is extremely difficult to keep them inside, if that is what you're saying by having their own room. Though it is possible, it's not ideal and it's not very easy because arctics smell, not the foxes themselves but their urine and feces, and they also prefer being outside rather than inside, speaking from experience.
Tim74
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Re: Foxy from Texas

Postby Tim74 » Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:14 am

Thanks. We live in Texas so I am worried about the heat. I have a workshop and in that workshop is another room. It is about 20 ft by 20 ft. With lots of windows. It has concrete floors. I would like to give it the best environment possible. I know foxes burrow and like to dig. I am even considering filling up the whole room with dirt etc to make a nice home. Thats why I need any advice. My assumption is I would have to clean an outdoor pen so I would have to do the same for an indoor one.
Tim74
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Re: Foxy from Texas

Postby Tim74 » Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:16 am

There is no doubt this is new to us. I am trying to gain as much knowledge as possible. We have raised all sorts of animals from birth etc, but I have no first hand knowledge of foxes.
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Ciaobella
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Re: Foxy from Texas

Postby Ciaobella » Tue Jun 12, 2012 1:26 pm

I know next to nothing about foxes but I will be watching out to see how your indoor build goes, sounds interesting!
Was Cierpke, lost password xD
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Elina
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Re: Foxy from Texas

Postby Elina » Tue Jun 12, 2012 3:06 pm

It is not legal for you to have a pet fox in Texas: http://www.raskbb.com/sybilsden/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=9018&start=15
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http://theflashmans.blogspot.com/ - Online home of Elspeth and Harry Flashman the Corsac foxes.
http://flashmanfoxes.webs.com - Photos and videos of my foxlings!
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the_unstable
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Re: Foxy from Texas

Postby the_unstable » Tue Jun 12, 2012 4:53 pm

As Elina said, not legal, though we have had loads of members from Texas on here who were interested in getting them. Also, before acquiring an animal, it is important to research the care very thoroughly so you know what you're getting into. A fox is definitely not an animal you want to just up and buy without knowing anything about it. They are noisy, destructive, and smelly.
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Elina
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Re: Foxy from Texas

Postby Elina » Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:35 pm

Look at http://www.exoticanimalsforsale.net/sal ... x-Pups.asp 13 arctic fox kits born on 6/1/12. I plan on buying one and still looking for another breeder. I would like to breed them as well since they are so limited. They do ship.


I saw your above post just now.

Where you say that they are so limited they really are not actually. There are many breeders of them in the US you just need to know where and when to look. They can also have rather large litters which last year meant that Dave from Tiny tracks ended up taking at least one litter of his to auction where I believe normally he sells them directly to people.

As to own them in Texas you need to be a breeder you may have trouble selling any as there are strict rules about getting permission to sell them outside of Texas. For someone within Texas to be able to buy one from you they would also have to find a secondary breeder if they were just starting up so that they could have an unrelated pair.

If you cannot find someone to take on the kits you breed do you have a back up plan of what to do with them?
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http://theflashmans.blogspot.com/ - Online home of Elspeth and Harry Flashman the Corsac foxes.
http://flashmanfoxes.webs.com - Photos and videos of my foxlings!
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the_unstable
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Re: Foxy from Texas

Postby the_unstable » Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:51 pm

Adding on to what Elina said about them not being limited, they are also bred in fur farms...lots and lots of them all over. They're not rare or limited by any means.

You need to get your permits and/or licenses BEFORE acquiring the animals. You'll have to have cages built and inspected before you can get licensed, if it's even possible.
Tim74
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Re: Foxy from Texas

Postby Tim74 » Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:33 pm

Thanks for the input. By limited I meant in Texas and far south. When I first started to look up foxes in Texas I to thought they were illegal. However I looked into the actual state laws. It is illegal to own a fur bearing animal except you can get a permit for them from the Texas parks and wildlife. Not only did i find this online but I talked to TPWD. She confirmed it as well

The process is you have to do an application first and pay an $95 annual fee per type of species. To have a fox brought in to own you must get a certificate of health from the seller and authorization from the Texas health dept. She said health dept will turn down every single red or gray fox but will allow arctic and fennec foxes. So it appears it is legal to have an arctic and fennec fox in Texas

Here are the websites.
http://info.sos.state.tx.us/pls/pub/rea ... =65&rl=377


http://www.tpwd.state.tx.us/publication ... 0_0065.pdf

http://www.tpwd.state.tx.us/publication ... packet.pdf
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TamanduaGirl
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Re: Foxy from Texas

Postby TamanduaGirl » Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:56 pm

It's legal with the permit, yes. It's not legal as a pet they will not give the permit for pet reasons. There is a breeder or two in TX of fennecs but they too will tell you they can't sell to anyone in the state as pets. If you do get the propagator license the renewals can be denied if you are not propagating(breeding). If denied you will then lose your fox.

The red and gray fox part you mentioned only applies to the import. So if found in the state they would still fall under the exact same law and need a propagator permit. If you are a propagator you could probably buy from in state fur farms.

Did you actually talk to the head of TPWD? If you did you misunderstood what she said. I have emails from her stating in fact you can NOT have fennecs or any species of fox as pets. What you refer to also says no foxes as PETS.

If you want to be a breeder fine but again bear in mind you will lose the license if they find out you are keeping it as a pet instead of breeder.
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the_unstable
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Re: Foxy from Texas

Postby the_unstable » Tue Jun 12, 2012 8:13 pm

Also, please please please research thoroughly before buying these animals, ESPECIALLY before getting a bunch of them to breed and sell to others. You don't want your buyers to be more educated on foxes than you are. They really should not be kept inside and if you're breeding them, they will not be tame like a pet. Some people even have their foxes behave more aggressively just from being kept indoors; they are much happier outdoors.

If you breed, you need to spend a lot of time with your kits if you're selling them as pets (which requires a USDA license and inspections with a lot of requirements to meet). They all need to be pulled around 2 weeks of age, before the eyes are open, and fed every few hours AROUND THE CLOCK. You essentially will get little-to-no sleep during breeding season and you wouldn't be able to go to any sort of job since you need to feed kits every few hours. If they aren't pulled and hand-raised, they will not be pet quality and it would be quite unkind to buyers to sell them as pets.

Expanding onto my first paragraph and some of the second - USDA requires CLEAN facilities. If kept indoors, it may be harder to keep clean. Urine will soak into the floors and ruin your home - and make it reek horribly. Their urine smells like a skunk. Not just like it but...as if they were a skunk. They are noisy, especially during the spring. Your neighbors will not appreciate that and having calling foxes in your house will not be enjoyable for you, either.

You need to make sure your city and county do not have any ordinances prohibiting possession of these animals. Some cities or counties may also require permits. You must obey every level - city, county, and state. If one prohibits it, then you cannot have them. USDA will also not give you a license if you're violating city or county law.

Again. Research. For a long, long time before getting these animals. Get first hand experience with actual foxes so you can determine if you really want to have some of your own. Breeders should be very knowledgeable and experienced in the species that they breed.
Tim74
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Re: Foxy from Texas

Postby Tim74 » Tue Jun 12, 2012 8:55 pm

Great posts. Thanks. I am so glad to find this site for you have an appreciation for animals like I do. We were planning to buy 2 foxes from different sellers so we would be a propagator. It is the only way to keep some. Newborn animals is nothing new to us. We are used to around the clock care for new born animals. From dogs cats, llamas, horses, bot bellied pigs etc, etc. I fully understand the amount of work it will take to work with a fox. Although I do admit I lack the experience I do not lack the passion. We have to start some time and this is what the forum is for those who can not have more experience hands on. We do live in country so no ordinances or neighbors. The location of where I though of putting them is in a separate building which is on a slab of concrete. Has full plumbing and even a shower in there. After reading posts I plan of converting a window to an outdoor pen as well so they can have the best of both worlds. In the room I wasnplannin on filling it with dirt, woodchips, and straw. Still learning but this is what I think will work from what i researched. Please remember I am from Texas. The heat outside will be unbearable
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the_unstable
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Re: Foxy from Texas

Postby the_unstable » Tue Jun 12, 2012 9:00 pm

We do live in country so no ordinances or neighbors.

Unless Texas is magically different, being in the "country" or rather a rural area does not mean that city nor county ordinances apply. Some cities have limits that reach much further than you might think - miles out of the actual city. Counties, well...self-explanatory.

The idea of having a window to allow them to go outside as well as in is a good idea. Fans will be good to help keep them cool but you need a way for them to be able to get to the cords to chew them up.
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Re: Foxy from Texas

Postby TamanduaGirl » Tue Jun 12, 2012 9:04 pm

That sounds like a reasonable plan then. You will still need to look into getting permission to sell them out of state. It reads like you will need permission for everyone you sell or you would have to sell them to a broker so that every kit will be covered under the one letter for the one recipient.

(c) No person shall sell or export live fur-bearing animals outside this state without possessing a letter of authorization from the wildlife division. A request for authorization shall include written documentation verifying that the recipient of the live animals is in compliance with applicable regulations in the destination state. A copy of the completed authorization shall accompany the animals at all times during shipment or be attached to the shipping container used to export the animals.


You also should not fill the room with dirt and such. It needs to be easily cleanable for USDA so leave it cement floor but you can have containers of dirt to dig in and hay or stray for bedding.

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