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flying foxes

Fresh, Salt, & Pond fish. Aquatic inverts, jelly fish, shrimp, octopus, etc.

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BB
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flying foxes

Postby BB » Sun Feb 08, 2009 12:53 am

Hey non-existent fish people,
I've got two flying foxes in my aquarium which started to eat each other.
I don't know what triggered it but they are sucking the mucus of each other!
There is enough algae in the tank, additionally I feed algae tablets every day (with other fish food), regular water changes and filter cleanings, and the PH seems ok. (I've got one of those test kits which performs five different tests and they all turn out good)
It is a four foot tank so I cannot see that size is the problem, no other fish are annoying them neither....
Any suggestions?
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Postby TamanduaGirl » Sun Feb 08, 2009 3:00 am

give them something for protein. They are omnivores algae pellets are not enough. The little frozen blood worm packets are good for protein, brine shimp are also okay, the salt they add is minimal and if you change the water properly shouldn't accumulate and a little salt in a fresh water tank is actually good anyway. You can also put fresh veggies in there like spinach for them to eat instead of just pellets all the time.

How many fish do you have in the tank and how many gallons is it? Does the test kit test for ammonia?

Pretty sure it is protein need they will do that when looking for protein big sucker fish will even eat other smaller fish. I got one of those tiny frogs and put it in the tank my armored catfish ate it, oops.
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Postby Trefoil » Sun Feb 08, 2009 5:45 am

Try shrimp pellets, if you can get them there. But once they start, you might have to separate them to stop it.
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Postby BB » Sun Feb 08, 2009 7:47 am

Thanks for the info, I've got blood worms and frozen shrimps in the freezer but I feed that normally as a treat. I'll feed it to them tomorrow and see what happens.
It is a 4 foot fish tank about 300l (78gallon, I hope this is right) The big fish are blue acaras x4, two flying foxes, one bristle nose, one upside down catfish, another catfish, I'm not quite sure what he is..., three silver Dollars, five sepea tetras, three scissor tails, five black neons, three danios , six small native rainbows, three congo tetras and three other tetras I forgot the name in the moment.
I took all the big rainbows out because I had the feeling the tank was overpopulated; It is pretty busy now but much smaller fish.
Oh, the test kit covers ammonia which tests fine.
Every now and again I put rock salt in it but I've never been able to feed the fish lettuce or spinach. It is recommended to blanch it, but still, the fish wont touch it..?
Anyway, I'll try what you guys suggested and keep you posted, Thanks again!
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Postby TamanduaGirl » Sun Feb 08, 2009 7:35 pm

Weird the catfish should at least eat it. mine loves veggies. she really like celery. Sometimes it has to be in a few day before she really starts getting noticeable bites out of it. I can't remember about the teras but our mollies(they have another name but I'm forgetting it at the moment) would pic at veggies too. Does sound like more may be to much so good you moved the others. The rough rule of thumb is !inch of fish per gallon of water. So for example my cat fish is at least a foot 12 inches so takes 12 gallong of water all by herself but probably over that since catfish produce a lot of waist though with a good filter 12 gallons per cat fish is probably still okay long as you don't let the ammonia build up. But for us that means our catfish takes up about half of our 30 gallon tank.

1 US gallon = 3.78541178 liters
300 liter = 79.2516157 US gallon

So assuming 12 inches per catfish you are over the limit with the rest of these three silver Dollars, five sepea tetras, three scissor tails, five black neons, three danios , six small native rainbows, three congo tetras and three other tetras.

The ones I didn't list plus 2-3 teras is about all you should have in there.

How often do you do water changes and how much?

Making sure the water is airraited really well will also help.

The main problem described sounds most like a protein issue though so giving tube worms more often will help. Each catfish should have about a cub a week(not sure of your size but we have small cubes) The flying foxes are smaller so can do with less. To save on worms you can put in extra fish food and they will eat what settles and sometimes learn to come to the top and eat the floating food, our does sometimes. But the extra food can also make the water messy faster and it's not as much protein as the worms.
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Postby Trefoil » Sun Feb 08, 2009 11:09 pm

BB - have you had your upside down catfish long? I know this is off topic, but I have what i bought as an upside down catfish when he was about an inch long and soooo cute. He's now about 5-6" and huge around, he still spends a lot of time upside down,but i haven't found any pictures of them that big and his stomach (?) is huge. So i am sorta wondering if he really is an upsidedown catfish. I have a lot of bristlenose, they breed like there is no tomorrow. I have 3 raphael catfish that are close to 20 years old. A 13" (about) pleco, and an iridescent shark thats over a foot long. In with these monsters I have a small school of green fire tetras and a small school of what used to be called rasbora espei, and several panda and albinio catfish. All this in one 120 gallon tank. I know i'm overcrowded, but can't find anyone to take my pleco or iridescent shark. I rescued the shark from a friend that was going to throw him out because he got too big and now he's even bigger and I still haven't found him a home. The pet shops around here tell people they only get around 6", i think it should be illegal to sell fish to hobbists that get that large.
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Postby BB » Mon Feb 09, 2009 6:57 am

Mary, I change my water every two weeks about half of the tank, and clean the filter. I also got a full length airstone in the tank and the filter also sucks in air and mixes it with the normal filtering. Before I fed the bloodworms and shrimp today I've noticed they stopped eating each other and their colour was back to normal....(I forgot to mention they don't touch any other fish) I feed them at least once a day flake food, sinking food pellets and algae tablets. Sometimes I feed some flakes for a second time in the afternoon.
I think my Acaras are taking care of the population, I've noticed there are only two danios and two scissors left, the dollars and other tetras are still there... :roll:
I'll try celery, do you just chuck it in or do the hot water thing first?

Trefoil,
I had two upside-downs for about over two years, I hardly see them because the hide under the logs. One day I noticed one of them so blown up and he was still alive, poor thing, I gave him one more day and he died on the day. The other one is still ok, and yes they are quite fat.
I've only got one bristle nose now he is about 1 1/2 years, they are actually illigal where I live. (they weren't five years ago, but suddenly the law was made)
Down south you still can get them, same with Plecos. I'd love to have one.
I would put him in my 6000l (1585 gal)pond and never see him again. I actually put a bristle nose in there, I'm not quite sure he is alive...
I've got this catfish but I'm not quite sure what type he is..
He hasn't got the sucker plate but has a mouth like a pictus but rounder at the front. He's got four long bartels or do you call it barbels?, is brown with black dots all over him. The tail and dorsel fin are white.
I love the description of your tank, this is unbelievable about your 20 year old catfish. How big do these Raphael's get?
I know it is difficult to take photos but have you got any of your tank?
I find it the easiest to take photos just on dark with the flash on.
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Postby Trefoil » Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:40 pm

The raphaels hide all the time they are the spotted variety, so black with small white dots all over. only about 5-6" long, but really look like they swallowed a hardball. they are probably bigger around than they are long. , I'll try to get a picture of the upside down catfish. Have you tried to feed broccoli, zucchini, or peas? I nuke it for a minute or two, until it sinks. Usually I squirt the peas out between my fingers, so they don't get the "shell" of the pea. I can't think of any catfish that have white tail & top fin with spotted bodies. Could it be a synodontis?
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Postby BB » Wed Feb 11, 2009 9:55 am

Trefoil you are a genius! it is a synodontis multipunctatus. I checked him out last night and wanted to tell you that the white on his fins actually surrounds the black but you worked it out anyway! Thanks! :bear
I will try the peas and zucchinis like you said and also the celery Mary suggested.
In the moment everything is well, maybe the blood worms done the trick!
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Postby TamanduaGirl » Thu Feb 12, 2009 12:02 am

I just toss the celery in there. I've given her carrots before too but it takes her much longer to eat that. It never even occurred to me to cook them a bit first. Would soften them up but I think the water does that naturally if you give it a few days. My bunny wont eat cooked veggies so maybe it would smell weird to fish too.

I've seen it recommended to change the water 3/4 every week if over crowded but if they look okay they probably are. If you test covers ammonia test for that right before you change the water if it is up then you should change more often. The ammonia build up is bad for them and can effect color.
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Postby BB » Sat Feb 21, 2009 8:52 pm

Just a quick update.
Tested the water today and every thing is ok.
The flying foxes still have some attempt to eat each other but not as aggressive as I mentioned before. I cannot get myself to separate them.
I still haven't tried the celery yet, but I threw some peas and carrots in it and they have disappeared.
I also put some rock salt in it to help resistance to diseases.
The blue acaras spawned again but lately they are pretty hopeless in hatching. (Even if they get the eggs hatched the little ones don't last very long in the community tank)
I always get enjoyment out of changing the water in my tanks, you really can see the appreciation from the fish.

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