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SUGGESTION

Exotic legal issues, bans, laws, regulations, Animal Rights discussions etc.

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codycatz
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SUGGESTION

Postby codycatz » Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:08 pm

Having done 20 years of lobbying on behalf of my profession in New Jersey I would HIGHLY suggest that one of you undertake the task of writing your own bill. It is not difficult as most of the bills are boiler plate anyway,.

I think most would agree on a certain amount of regulation ( safe and clean living conditions for the animals etc.) and when the bill is written i would guarantee you will get a sponsor. Look for someone who is leery about the one being put forth right now and would love to be able to say that they too are concerned for public safety and here i a bill that would make that compromise.
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Re: SUGGESTION

Postby cat person » Wed Mar 21, 2012 7:49 pm

codycatz wrote:Having done 20 years of lobbying on behalf of my profession in New Jersey I would HIGHLY suggest that one of you undertake the task of writing your own bill. It is not difficult as most of the bills are boiler plate anyway,.


I would, LOVE, to try. But, you would, "need to hold my hand". I am not a good writer, at all, plus, I am not, terribly brighter either. Last, but not least, I am mega ditsy. But, maybe, it is worth a try?

codycatz wrote:I think most would agree on a certain amount of regulation ( safe and clean living conditions for the animals etc.) and when the bill is written i would guarantee you will get a sponsor.


I, for one, definitely, agree with, a certain amount of regulation. Especially, regarding, the ideas, that are listed above.

codycatz wrote:Look for someone who is leery about the one being put forth right now and would love to be able to say that they too are concerned for public safety and here i a bill that would make that compromise.


What state, would, the bill before? Yes, I am dense and ditzy.



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amyers
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Re: SUGGESTION

Postby amyers » Wed Mar 21, 2012 8:48 pm

I definitely like the idea. I'd like to get some input from some owners of other types of animals on what "fair" would be. Cats and what in FL are "Class IIIs" I think I've got a decent handle on. I'd like to know more about canids, ursids, and primates in particular.
Proud mom to 11 domestic cats, 3 dogs, 2 bobcats, 3 servals, 2 cougars, 1 Siberian lynx, 1 squirrel, and counting!
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caninesrock
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Re: SUGGESTION

Postby caninesrock » Wed Mar 21, 2012 9:20 pm

@amyers: You're not going to present the bill to Florida? Are you? They haven't even made any new regulations or bans since the Ohio incident and I'm afriad if someone brings it up with a bill, they'll start looking into it. I feel like asking them to unban already banned animals will have an opposite effect and just make them ban even more animals especially if you use arguments like x animal is dangerous too or just as dangerous or more dangerous than y animal(Not saying you personally would use those kind of argument, just that when people in general use them, it usually results in banning of those species too instead of unbanning of the banned species.)

Do I think it's fair for them to ban Class I animals? No
But the last thing we need right now is for them to ban even more animals by adding them to Class I in an attempt to get them to remove the currently listed Class I animals.
Exotic Wishlist: high content wolfdog or wolf,low to mid content wolfdog, Coyote, Coydog, Black-backed Jackal, New Guinea Singing Dog, Red Fox, Gray Fox, Mink, Raccoon, Coati,and Kinkajou.

Domestic Wishlist: dogs, cats, ferrets, donkey, mule
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amyers
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Re: SUGGESTION

Postby amyers » Wed Mar 21, 2012 11:02 pm

I wouldn't bother with FL. I think the bans already in place are a lot more pressing. It would be nice to have something in our "back pockets" so to speak, that we could pull out as an alternative to some of the bans. Realistically, it probably wouldn't do anything, but you never know...

Trust me, I know all about uplisting. They bumped my cougars from Class II to Class I in 2009. My husband got licensed at the facility where we board them, but I didn't have my hours when the deadline passed. Now we have to find at least five acres so we can move...just so I can keep my own animals if something happens to him. :wall:
Proud mom to 11 domestic cats, 3 dogs, 2 bobcats, 3 servals, 2 cougars, 1 Siberian lynx, 1 squirrel, and counting!
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codycatz
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Re: SUGGESTION

Postby codycatz » Thu Mar 22, 2012 6:45 am

I was refering to Ohio.

One way to block "uplisting" is to make the bill a "Sunset Bill" meaning that it dies after a fixed date and either is revised and put forth again for vote or does in fact die. this works for controversial bills when little is known about the outcome. it is VERY difficult to retract a bill once enacted but this venue can work instead.

Making a counter bill also shows them that you are a SERIOUS and organized group. It also puts something on the table that people can get behind and not only be against everything.
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veralidaine
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Re: SUGGESTION

Postby veralidaine » Thu Mar 22, 2012 11:25 am

That 'sunset' bill sounds good. That way we can test drive any regulations we put forth, so to speak.

I would be very careful if constructing our own regulations. We would not want to provide them with the stick with which to beat us. By that, I mean that if we get certain regulations passed, it is possible for others to slightly manipulate them, then say to us "Well, you agree with that, so surely you'd agree with this too." They'll be very good at saying it in a very logical manner that will lead us to believe that 'oh, it's just a smidge stricter, it'll be okay' and then before we know it, the regulations are so strict, it's basically a ban. We know how devious and determined AR people can be; they will try their best to use our own words against us, which would be a very powerful weapon.

A regulation I've always thought would be good, because it is pretty black and white and would be difficult to manipulate, would be a size restriction based on zoning. If someone lives in urban residential, they can have an animal that grows to be 'so high' and 'so long' (I would think size of fennec fox or skunk would be good); if they live in suburban residential, they can have an animal that will grow to be 'so high' and 'so long' (maybe bobcat, wolfdog, ball python?) and the same for rural residential and rural agricultural with the limits being a bit larger for rural agricultural? I can see the distinction between rural residential and rural agricultural being a bit contested but I'm sure we could figure that out.

I feel that something like that would be difficult to manipulate negatively because it is purely practical (not moral or based on supposed danger of an animal) and does not discriminate between species. Another important thing to note would be the fact that officials would only be required to measure the size of the animal and make sure it's within the proper limits, which would not take any kind of specialized knowledge. As great as it would be to have regulations about a clean and safe environment, this would require officials with specialized knowledge (which we would probably want to put in the bill, emphasizing that the officials would need to be knowledgeable in the care of exotics). The problem with this is convincing the government to acquire these specialized people, which will take extra money, when they could just have a ban and not have to pay any extra money at all.
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Amberthebobcat
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Re: SUGGESTION

Postby Amberthebobcat » Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:09 pm

Maybe I should give it a try. Actually, the suggestion I have been giving the senators that I speak with is this. Kill SB310 and make it easy. Since the USDA does not issue a license to the so called "pet" owner, Ohio could just adopt those rules for the pet owner. For all others breeders, exhibitors, sanctuaries etc, they would be required to be USDA licensed. USDA has caging, feeding, etc, requirements and does random inspections. However, they are getting a LOT of pressure from the Governor to BAN these animals. But the Senators should keep in mind. They do not work for the governor, they work for the people of the state. Otherwise we would have a dictator that rules all. Oh wait, we have that now!!!!
In the cougar's den with 4 domestic cats, 5 bobcats and 1 loving cougar :-)
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caninesrock
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Re: SUGGESTION

Postby caninesrock » Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:53 pm

Ok. I was just making sure. And yeah, uplisting sucks. I've never experienced it myself since I haven't owned exotics but a man came to the wolf sanctuary I volunteered at and gave us his lower mid?/low content wolfdogs because the county he lived in had just passed a ban on wolfdogs and wouldn't let him keep them and he would either have to move again(he had already moved 3 times due to various other counties in Texas passing the ban) or have them confiscated and euthanized unless he got rid of them so he brought them to our licensed facility/rescue voluntarily and we took them in. He was allowed to come and visit them of course. Sorry the government did something simliar to your cougars. :(
Exotic Wishlist: high content wolfdog or wolf,low to mid content wolfdog, Coyote, Coydog, Black-backed Jackal, New Guinea Singing Dog, Red Fox, Gray Fox, Mink, Raccoon, Coati,and Kinkajou.

Domestic Wishlist: dogs, cats, ferrets, donkey, mule

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