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Any body from Florida?

Coatimundis, Kinkajous, Raccoons, Ringtails, Cacomistles, Olingos

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Yatzee
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Any body from Florida?

Postby Yatzee » Thu Aug 23, 2018 12:12 pm

Here's the story.
Earlier this week I was tagged in a facebook post made by someone looking for a vet recommendation to spay a pet raccoon.
I replied with a screen shot of Yatzee's vet's contact info. He is located in Orlando.
This lady asking for recommendations and I are both located in Ocala.
She replies to my screenshot saying, I have an appointment with Dr. Osborne, which is located in Ocala. Ok, cool, I have delt with him before and I think he has mental issues but, to each thier own.
Later that day, she replies to our conversation saying, Osborne recommended Dr. Diaz to do the spay. I was like cool, he's a better vet.
Well, last night she made another reply to our conversation. This reply was a sad one. Her raccoon bit the Tech and the Dr. Told him to go to the hospital. He reported it as a raccoon bite. Well, the health department requested the raccoon be euthanized and sent to be tested for rabies.!!!!!!!!
Ok, first off, she made it sound like this happened with Dr. Diaz. So I started freaking out because Yatzee is scheduled for a neuter next month and he doesn't like strangers and I know he's going to bite. Thankfully, for me, this happened with Osborne.
Osborne had his tech put a mask over the raccoon to sedate it. Well, no raccoon is going to allow that to happen. So, the raccoon attacked. I was a tech for 10 years. We used a plastic box for aggressive animals that needed sedation, no one got hurt.
So, I blame Osborne for the fate of poor Matilda.
BUT, I can't find anywhere on the FWC website where pet raccoons need to be euthanized and sent to check for rabies. All I can see is, this applies to wild raccoons.
Shouldn't they have contacted FWC for what to do?
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Ash
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Re: Any body from Florida?

Postby Ash » Thu Aug 23, 2018 1:01 pm

Unfortunately, that's the law in many if not all states... It's part of the health department's code about animals that don't have an approved rabies vaccine. They need to be put down if they bite.

To avoid this from happening to you, offer to restrain the coon yourself and ask that he be sedated prior to having a mask put on him. Then if he bites anyone, it's going to be you. I had to do this for my fox Nova when he was hospitalized.

I'm sorry this happened to your friend... Maybe the health department won't look into it much, although that's rarely the case. I'll keep my fingers crossed for your friend and their coon.
3 red fox, 4 pectinata iguanas, nile monitor, BW tegu, sailfin dragon, leachie gecko, 6 snakes, salamander, 3 tarantulas
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Yatzee
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Re: Any body from Florida?

Postby Yatzee » Thu Aug 23, 2018 1:23 pm

She offered to help with her raccoon and the Vet said regulations don't allow her to help. Which is crap. We had clients help with aggressive dogs and cats all the time.
So, another question. What is the point of obtaining a permit or even doing vaccines if a pet raccoon is treated no differently than a wild one?
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DeweysMom
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Re: Any body from Florida?

Postby DeweysMom » Thu Aug 23, 2018 1:34 pm

If you are remotely worried that you could find yourself in a similar situation as you described, may I remind you that YOU are the owner, therefore YOU control the situation and YOU dictate how your raccoon is to be handled. If your veterinary staff won't work with you on how to handle your raccoon, leave and find one that will. Take NO chances. Your raccoon's life depends on it.

Very few raccoons are calm enough to be handled by strangers without an incident - especially in an environment such as a vet clinic - whether it's biting or scratching. It's unfamiliar for your raccoon, as are the people who are working on him/her. As you stated, your personal experience with animals of such temperament dictated that they be sedated in a sedation box, rather than via injection or mask. My experience with raccoons at the vet is the same. Whenever mine need to be examined, or treated in any way, I always opt for the safest route - which is the sedation box. Also, I am VERY fortunate that my vet allows me to stay with my raccoons during any and all procedures, from start to finish. Even surgeries, I was permitted to be in the room. This allows YOU total control, allows YOU to read your raccoon and allows YOU to STOP unsafe or out-of-control situations.

It also allows for the safety and well being of your raccoon. During one surgery, I noticed that my one raccoon did not seem to be sedated heavily enough and I pointed it out to the staff. (He was moving his legs just a bit when they neutered him.) They immediately stopped the procedure, gave a bit more sedation, then continued. It made me feel better knowing that I was there to observe HIM because their focus was on the surgery.

Since the rabies vaccine isn't "recognized" as being effective in raccoons (which is bullshit because it IS effective, like, why else would some F&W agencies spend the $$ to do rabies block drops in high rabies areas???), your raccoon MUST be protected from biting someone. Sedation is really the only option. And if there's not a 'safe' way to get your raccoon into the sedation box (or they won't allow YOU to do it), then have them wrap the carrier you brought him in with a garbage bag and sedate him in that.

I find HEAVY fault on the staff of that veterinary clinic. First off, all staff members should KNOW that they cannot report a bite from a raccoon, should they need medical care. Secondly, ALL staff at veterinary clinics should be up to date on THEIR rabies shots. And if they are bitten, they should follow the protocol that is recommended by the medical community after being bitten by an animal that *could* possibly have rabies (ie un-vaccinated animal, or in this case, a raccoon) and be given a series of vaccines to protect them.

Honestly, this vet outfit scares me. Were I you, if you truly wish to use their services, I would definitely ensure that they're going to work with you as I stated above, or I would RUN, not walk, to a different one.

So sad a raccoon lost its life because of the ineptitude of a veterinary clinic that should have well known better. No reason for it. NONE at ALL. :cry:
Dana

2 Dogs - a Nova Scotia Duck Tolling Retriever, & an Australian Shepherd; 3 Cats; 2 horses, 1 mule; One very spoiled raccoon and the love of my life, Dewey James, and the recently added but much adored, Bobby Lee, brother raccoon to Dewey
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Re: Any body from Florida?

Postby TamanduaGirl » Thu Aug 23, 2018 6:02 pm

Yes it's the law to euthanize and test any animal that bites that does not have an approved rabies vaccine for it. While other tests exist they are still not as accurate as a brain biopsy(because rabies is a weird nervous system disease) so they go with the most accurate by law. The only out for the animal would be if the tech agreed to get the post exposure rabies shots, but even in those cases sometimes the states will just stick to the rules and test/kill the animal but it often is a way to save the animal. I think Florida is one where they would spare the animal's life if the tech was willing to get the shots.

This is a good thing to have a discussion with your vet about though. "Will you report if there is a bite?" "are you and your staff willing to get rabies post exposure shots if there is a bite to prevent my animal being tested if you do report it?" "Can I stay with my animal and do most of the handling to help ensure there wont be a bite?" It's possible their insurance didn't allow for the owner helping, as it costs more, as stupid as it is, because the client could sue if helping and their own animal bites them. Oh also might be good to ask if the vet would report it if YOU are bit as well if you are handling it since they could, though they have some incentive not to because of the insurance thing. Human DRs legally have to report animal injuries, not sure if some states may require that of the vets.

My vet is great that way and lets me stay and handle my exotics. And even when Hyzzie dog was on her last days and we were still trying she had me sit with her as she got her IV all day and help keep her calm while they did the ultrasound on her.

I gave Ikigai his rabies shot just because, if you can tell someone who is scratched or bit that he is vaccinated, they will be less inclined to panic and go to a doctor about it, the DR legally would then have to report the bite, so if you can keep them from going to a DR by telling them he's vaccinated it might save them by preventing a report. If you house an animal outside at all it also does protect them. Should a rabid bat or something get in the enclosure he wont get rabies. There was a bear from a zoo/exhibitor that became ill and tested positive for rabies, it had been at a party earlier so everyone at the party needed shots after! So any animal that is housed outside at all is safer to have the shot and it has a slight chance of helping save them by calming the person injured to not report it.

If you raccoon is sedated be there with it and be the one to handle it as it wakes up as it will be confused so more likely to bite someone as it wakes up.
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Re: Any body from Florida?

Postby Trefoil » Mon Aug 27, 2018 2:05 pm

Sue the vet.Big Time. Unless its already too late sue to have the euthanization (?) stopped. Coons cannot be born with rabies, they have to been exposed to it. This is an example of a perfectly reasonable law being misused. This vet's incompetence has cost the life. Don't use that vet's office, even if its another vet and tell them why.
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Yatzee
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Re: Any body from Florida?

Postby Yatzee » Fri Sep 14, 2018 12:41 am

I left Dr. Osborne a year ago. I asked him if he knew anyone that babysat squirrels. He threatened to call the cops on me for harrassment.
I use Dr Diaz in Orlando. I had Yatzee neutered today and I was the only one allowed to touch him while he was awake. I felt very good about the experience.
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Yatzee
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Re: Any body from Florida?

Postby Yatzee » Fri Sep 14, 2018 12:44 am

I really wish there was a way to change the laws for pet raccoons.
You remember in school when they played the cartoon about how a bill becomes a law? Well, they should have shown a fat stack of money being handed to a politician cause, that's how it really works.
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DeweysMom
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Re: Any body from Florida?

Postby DeweysMom » Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:18 am

Sounds like everything went well for you and Yatzee. How is he feeling?

Yes, sadly, that IS how our political system works. I think a great start would be to outlaw lobbying/lobbyists. But - - - that'll NEVER happen, since so many in govt rely on that as additional 'income'. :-x
Dana

2 Dogs - a Nova Scotia Duck Tolling Retriever, & an Australian Shepherd; 3 Cats; 2 horses, 1 mule; One very spoiled raccoon and the love of my life, Dewey James, and the recently added but much adored, Bobby Lee, brother raccoon to Dewey
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Yatzee
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Re: Any body from Florida?

Postby Yatzee » Fri Sep 21, 2018 2:14 pm

He was doing good until yesterday when he fell. He developed a bruise on the left side of his incision. He was a cryptorcid so, he has 2 incisions. The abdomen one is the one that is bruised.
I've been in contact with the vet via email and pictures. I'm hoping this doesn't turn into something major.
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pat
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Re: Any body from Florida?

Postby pat » Sat Sep 22, 2018 11:15 am

it really pisses me off when vets or dnr/GC seem to think a pet raccoon is the same as a wild raccoon :roll:
yes, I can understand where a wild raccoon can get rabies. but as Dana said, rabie cakes are dropped for the wild wild raccoons.
that is how it in is in the state Dana and I live.

there are other means to putting a raccoon under sedation. there are pole injections through the carrier.
when I took mine up to get fixed, my vet let me handle them. all I would to is let them out of the carrier, scruff them, and hold them down.
the vet then injected him. however, there were times for other animals he would wear welding gloves to handle them without sedation.
my vet use to treat animals at a zoo so guess he knows how to handle them.

sadly, there are vets that are inexperienced with exotic animals icon-sad seems they are hard to come by.
maybe a suggestion would be call a zoo and ask about a good vet :shrug:
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