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Breeding season whoes

Breeding, caging, housing, bottle feeding, domestication, colors, in cage enrichment, etc.

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TooManyPets
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Breeding season whoes

Postby TooManyPets » Wed Feb 10, 2016 11:14 am

My female is with a good friend atm. With it being breeding season and her living with her brother, it had to be done. She spent weeks with his male and appears to not be pregnant. Another female was with him for a week and bam, pregnant. Thankfully he had another male to pair with her but now Im afraid we might have missed the window.

So now I want her home (been there for 6 freaking weeks) as she is very attached to me and hates my friend. But afraid Im gonna bring her home early and end up with inbred kits.


This is freaking stressful....
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GitaBooks
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Re: Breeding season whoes

Postby GitaBooks » Wed Feb 10, 2016 12:26 pm

I'm sorry that I don't know, but what species is she? (red fox?)

If she's living with her brother could you possibly neuter her brother to prevent that problem?

I hope she comes home soon and has some nice, health, adorable kits. icon-smile
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Re: Breeding season whoes

Postby TooManyPets » Wed Feb 10, 2016 2:39 pm

Both are reds.

Hopefully she will come home preggo.
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Ash
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Re: Breeding season whoes

Postby Ash » Wed Feb 10, 2016 3:41 pm

Hi. I know you're new to the board, so I don't know much about you. But welcome. :) That being said, I do have some concerns, and since I don't know you, I may ask questions that you may already know the answer to. Hope that's okay.

You realize that arctic foxes have HUGE litters. Sometimes up to 20 kits? What will you do with them?

Are you USDA-licensed? If you are not licensed, it's black market to sell or exchange them for anything of value--including another fox. They can only be given away or donated.

Not trying to scare you off or anything, and not trying to be critical, I just think you don't realize what a legal mess you're going to find yourself in if she is indeed pregnant.

Honestly, if I were in your situation, I would bring her home and have her spayed.

Once again, not trying to be critical. I just really want to inform you before you find yourself in trouble with the feds.
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Re: Breeding season whoes

Postby TamanduaGirl » Wed Feb 10, 2016 4:07 pm

Dang I just wrote long reply then saw Ash beat me to it. Good thing I forget it was arctics and was replying for reds lol.

I don't know as much about them. In reds they need at least a few months to form a pair bond but it seems like arctics may bond quicker. They can be both monogamous or polygamous but they still normally choose the same mates each season. Maybe the male was a mono and didn't want another mate. I know in reds the actual fertile window is 3 weeks. I'm not sure in arctics but yeah you could have missed it. Hard to say on exact breeding season too since it can vary by local climate and weather some.

Yep USDA is a concern. You BOTH have to be USDA licensed to sell these babies and the breeder loans well documented. The only legal way(if you're not licensed) is if your friend is licensed and she stays till after she has the babies and he sells the babies and keeps all the money and then there still needs to be documentation of the breeder loan or as Ash said you just keep them ALL for yourself or give them away to friends but don't just pretend to give them away and actually get paid they do have ways of finding that out and people have been busted for it.
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Re: Breeding season whoes

Postby naja-naja » Sun Mar 13, 2016 1:43 pm

do you need to be usda if you're breeding only as a hobby? i thought the law was you had to have more then 3 breeding females or something like that, seems very OTT if a pet owner is selling babies as a sideline. I know there are reptile keepers with hundreds of animals that might produce 1000+ babies a year none of them are licenced or regulated like that.
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TamanduaGirl
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Re: Breeding season whoes

Postby TamanduaGirl » Sun Mar 13, 2016 2:55 pm

Hobby breeder exemption is for domestics only, which includes some common pet store rodents but specifically states it does not apply to wild or exotic animals. Though I was made aware that some local inspectors apply it to other small exotics in order to lower their work load by not licensing people. It is also says under $500 in sales annually for the hobby exemption. So if you sold 2 sugar gliders for $350 each you now need a license since it was more than $500 total for the year.

The breedable(intact) animal part only applies to dogs and cats.

USDA only covers mammals.
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Ash
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Re: Breeding season whoes

Postby Ash » Sun Mar 13, 2016 7:13 pm

^^TG said it. Exotics are not exempt.

Reptiles and birds are not regulated by the USDA. So that is why so many people can breed and sell them. USDA only covers mammals.
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Re: Breeding season whoes

Postby foxbreeder4523 » Mon May 02, 2016 9:06 am

Hi,

Im new to the forum. My experience with red fox (silvers mainly) is that natural/pair breeding is a real crapshoot.

Artificial insemination is the ideal breeding method.

And the window for conception is 2-3 days! Not weeks.
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Ash
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Re: Breeding season whoes

Postby Ash » Mon May 02, 2016 12:55 pm

Foxbreeder, I've been wanting to learn AI-ing techniques. My breeder AI's his foxes (Tiny Tracks). Most people don't have the equipment, but one day I'd like to get it if I ever start breeding foxes seriously.

Do you work at a fur farm? There are no farms in my state, so no one to teach me how.
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Re: Breeding season whoes

Postby TamanduaGirl » Mon May 02, 2016 1:03 pm

How do you even know the day to AI then? A dog breeder friend says they do blood tests but seems that could get expensive for a fox since they sell fairly cheap?
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Ash
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Re: Breeding season whoes

Postby Ash » Mon May 02, 2016 2:21 pm

I have heard it is a window of 2-3 days as well, actually. I always thought the sperm probably survive for a while, so the female would be "good" for the rest of the week.

It's pretty thorough what the farmers do. They check the vulva everyday, and they know when it's time.
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foxbreeder4523
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Re: Breeding season whoes

Postby foxbreeder4523 » Mon May 02, 2016 2:35 pm

Yes, My experience is from a fur farm. There are several indicators of when a female is ready to be bred and actually conceive.

This is based on thousands of female fox, learned from first hand experience and from many succesful fox farmers.

Vulva swelling is the initial indicator. Once adequate swelling is detected, a rut gauge is used. A probe about the diameter of a pencil inserted in the vaginal canal to take a ready of the mucus against the cervix. The readings are charted. The number starts low (100-200 ohms) and can peak (400-700 or more) the day it drops off from the peak, the female is ready to be bred.

Also the swelling of the vulva will decrease and become soft, as it needs to be able to have a fox penis inserted naturally.

Also, you can take use a 6" Q-Tip and do a smear of the mucus and look at the cells to determine what stage of heat the female is in. A microscope is required, which all fox farmers have and utilize for checking sperm.

There is also a technique to collect semen from the male, and keeping it warm and inseminating the female with a norwegian catheter. An artificial copulation device can also be used. Semen is fragile and temperature sensitive.

Thats the very basics of artificial insemination, I can explain more later.
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Re: Breeding season whoes

Postby foxbreeder4523 » Mon May 02, 2016 2:42 pm

No blood tests are necessary. A good A.I. fox breeder should have 90% conception or higher, some hit 95%.

Females are not checked everyday. Only the first day of checking females do you go through them all. After that, you know based on the swelling or lack thereof if she needs rechecked the following day, in 3 days, 5 days, etc. Most pup females come into heat later than older females.

Also artificial light can really impact the heat cycle and timing of when she comes into heat.

Some fox farmers start turning on lights at dusk until 8:00PM to expose more light to the females to expedite the heat cycle and bunching up their breeding.

A yard light or inconsistent light in late winter can throw the female off, possibly the male too. It's a major factor in reproduction.
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Ash
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Re: Breeding season whoes

Postby Ash » Mon May 02, 2016 3:28 pm

Thank you for the information. That is very interesting. I really would like to have experience at a farm.

There was a farming website that had a lot of visual guides to AI-ing foxes, and it was very informative and helpful. I can't remember the site though unfortunately. I'm sure I could find it if I searched though. You may know the site I'm referring to maybe.

I have noticed more and more how light cycles affect all animals. Reptiles, to mammals. Foxes kept indoors do not shed properly--it's like their fur is confused, lol. Once my foxes were put outdoors where they belonged, I noticed that their fur growth and loss was much more regular and uniform.
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