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SIBFOX SCAM and domestic fox discussion

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caninesrock
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Re: Sibfox

Postby caninesrock » Sun Oct 30, 2011 3:57 pm

I doubt they'll give a refund. Their emails scream scam:

foxes arrived in US,but unfortunately there were multiple problems with the foxes and USWF didn't allow them in USA.

It says the foxes arrived in the US,but they weren't allowed in the US. How can they have arrived if they weren't allowed in?

At this time foxes are in carantine and USWF ordered their shipment back to Russia with all associated charges (carantine,veterinary care, transportation to Russia) to be billed to SibFox.

They spelled quarintine wrong twice.


due to medical condition foxes were not allowed on a flight,but due to USWF order they can't stay in USA,therefore we used the only remaining option and signed a USWF form 3-2096 transferring foxes to be a government property - we were told they will be transferred to a zoo,but we will not have access to information what zoo or any other details.As of now,the foxes do not belong to us anymore.

If the foxes weren't allowed on a flight, how'd they get to the US? Can't stay in the US? I thought they weren't allowed into the US? If the foxes were deemed to have illnesses that prevented them from being allowed in the country, then why would they send them to a zoo in the US? Unless they mean a zoo in Russia.


thank you for your letter. Unfortunately,David is no longer with SibFox team.

We will not be able to provide information you're requesting.

It's very convenient that David suddenly no longer works for them. And why wouldn't they be able to provide that info?

@Zebrafox:I'm really sorry this happened to you. :(
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Re: Sibfox

Postby zebrafox » Sun Oct 30, 2011 4:10 pm

thank you all for the support. i do really appreciate it. at this point i hope the foxes were never shipped at all and that the bits about their health are just a lie. id rather it be a scam than that horrible treatment actually occuring. i asked why i cant recieve more information on the foxes whereabouts. i just got this response

Because foxes are not SibFox property anymore and they are not at port of entry anymore. Foxes are government property now and they were transferred to another facility (we do not have any information on what facility,where,etc). We were told by USFW that there is no and will be no additional information.

Please understand that we (SibFox) have not even seen the foxes - due to condition they arrived. Now we have to reimburse all customers,but the Institute considers this to be a SUCCESSFUL sale (because they believe that they SOLD foxes to SibFox and as long as foxes arrived to US - that's done deal) and they specifically stated that they will NOT take any responsibility for what happened.

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the_unstable
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Re: Sibfox

Postby the_unstable » Sun Oct 30, 2011 4:18 pm

We don't know for sure that it's a scam, but we will find out (assuming Zebra posts about it) when/if Zebra gets her refund. I hope it's alright but I was curious to see if the tracking number was valid. It is - and whatever is being shipped is coming from Austin Texas? I thought the institute was in Nevada?

It's interesting that they're pinning it all on the institute...is the institute even a reliable seller? And considering they're blaming the institute and making it sound like they're not doing business with them anymore, it'll be interesting to see the sibfox site still up and running just the same even months after this is over, because it probably will be.

Edit: Also, I too am sorry to hear that this has happened. It truly is heartbreaking and also immoral of them to do this to a person. I do hope that you get your refund. If it were me, I would really have my heart set on a fox at this point. You could look into getting a fox that is being rehomed this year. A lot of them get rehomed this time of year as they've reached the age of 6 months or so. Keep your eye out on exoticanimalsforsale.net and other sites such as hoobly. There is an ad for three foxes 6 months old in Ohio to be rehomed. http://www.hoobly.com/0/0/1842737.html Of course take care to make sure it is legit if you decide that you'd want to go for it. I have heard that Hoobly has a lot of scams. You can also contact breeders to see if any have any older kits left to rehome.
Last edited by the_unstable on Sun Oct 30, 2011 4:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Sibfox

Postby pat » Sun Oct 30, 2011 4:20 pm

zebrafox,

not that I know much about shipping foxes.

but, to me, I would think that since sibfox did all the paper work, they should have
received some type of documentation from this mess. icon_confused.gif

it really don't make sense.

I hope they keep their word of refunding your money back.

is there a way you can contact russia from where it was shipped?
I think they have an email address. don't know if you would get any answer.
but, you can try.
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Re: Sibfox

Postby cat person » Sun Oct 30, 2011 4:22 pm

Hi Zebrafox,

First of all, I want to say how sorry I am. I really am, and if you ever need to talk PM me.

Second, as other people have said the fox most likely never existed. So, I do not think it was shipped to the USA sick. If that makes you feel better, I do not know.

Now onto the money aspect, you want the money wired directly to your bank acount or a US postal money order(s). Any cashiers check scam can harm your financial standings. I have seen this happen to other people from other issues. If they do in fact send the check to you, show it to the POLICE then a bank. Then if they both agree it is a legitimate check then cash it.

Again I am so so so so sorry :(.


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Re: Sibfox

Postby Lasergrl » Sun Oct 30, 2011 4:51 pm

Yes, be carefull regarding the refund if it does come. There are multiple scams using fake checks, and also direct fed ex.

When all this is streightened out Kens exotics claims to be able to import them. He is fairly reliable so i would contact him next. If you choose to go the tame american route you cant go wrong with Mandys foxes. gizmo is her baby afterall.

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Re: Sibfox

Postby Ash » Sun Oct 30, 2011 5:17 pm

Zebra, even if sibfox was a scam that doesn't mean you can't have a Russian fox. In fact, you could fly to Russia and pick up two foxes directly from the Institute and then you would know for sure that they were domesticated. Leaving the country can be hard, but it would only need to be for 1-3 days. And then you could fly back with your babies.

Lasergrl: Unfortunately, Ken said he wasn't offering them anymore. However, I'll bet you could still hire him to handle all of the paperwork for you, so in that way he would be good to work with.
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Re: Sibfox

Postby Lasergrl » Sun Oct 30, 2011 5:23 pm

There is alot more to importing then just flying there and back with them unfortunately. It really is for the best to have an importer. You have to have a specially built carrier made of special wood that cant harbor disease. They have to have their medical record/passport book, permit ect.
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Re: Sibfox

Postby the_unstable » Sun Oct 30, 2011 5:25 pm

Read this thread about someone who wanted to go pick out their own kit from The Institute: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=8184&hilit=sibfox

It sounds very complicated.
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Re: Sibfox

Postby Elina » Sun Oct 30, 2011 5:29 pm

is the institute even a reliable seller?


Yes, the institute are perfectly apt sellers and they keep their foxes perfectly well. Yes they are in fur farm cages but they are kept healthy, vaccinated and happy.

When my sister got her fox from the institute he died on his way to the UK but that was due to the sedative having a bad reaction with him of something along those lines, the fox itself looked 100% fine according to the vet bar obviously being dead. When my sister contacted the institute the offered her a refund or if she would prefer to wait for the next litter that too was fine, they also invited her to go to Siberia to pick out her next fox in person. My sister has decided to go with this option however she is waiting until Spring 2012 as this year they had none of the morph she wanted.

I believe that the Sibfox foxes never existed, they came up with too much scammer talk for me to believe them and then to say the man you are dealing with suddenly does not work for them? (Delivered to your door, passport etc.) Bit convenient. . .

I wanted them to be real when I read how excited you were. I am very sorry that you are having to go through this heart break.

The institute already said they would not deal with Ken, someone on here was going to buy one through him before and it all fell through.

If you wanted a tame fox you could, if you were happy with a regular fox get one from Mandy or Dave at tiny tracks both of which have people on this board to back them up on how great their foxes are. :icon-wink:
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Alynn
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Re: Sibfox

Postby Alynn » Sun Oct 30, 2011 5:48 pm

So is the institute unwilling to do any brokering at all then? o_o
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the_unstable
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Re: Sibfox

Postby the_unstable » Sun Oct 30, 2011 5:49 pm

Elina wrote:
is the institute even a reliable seller?


Yes, the institute are perfectly apt sellers and they keep their foxes perfectly well. Yes they are in fur farm cages but they are kept healthy, vaccinated and happy.


Well it's good to hear that they do actually have foxes for sale. However, I don't know that I would completely agree with the "fur farm cages" being connected to being happy. I'm assuming they aren't taken out for exercise and they're not provided with toys, and I'm sure it's not fun to be stuck in a cage 24/7, which would then wear on one's health. However, I do admit that it is more practical for them to be kept the way that they are because there are so many foxes to care for and house and they are part of such a major experiment.

I wonder if they smell or not, because I have read that they do and that they do not.
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Re: Sibfox

Postby Alynn » Sun Oct 30, 2011 6:01 pm

*shrug* I've heard that they have no odor, but the article I read someone posted said that they had a very earthy scent to them.
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Re: Sibfox

Postby TamanduaGirl » Sun Oct 30, 2011 6:31 pm

I'm sorry it didn't work out. Most likely there is no fox as others said. The last part of the story isn't totally impossible. Being at a port of entry is a sort of limbo they are not officially in the country and they can be refused entry and sent back if everything is not right. They will charge the shipper or receiver for this. They really would not refuse entry for the animal looking sick though. Pua was a fresh import and in obviously bad shape and poor Kamena was in even worse so didn't make it. They don't take temperatures. They just look at the animals and send you through(we briefly had experience directly with this taking Pua and Stewie to Canada and back). No exam just peeked in at them, took photos but only because they wanted to show their families, ha, don't get anteaters coming from Canada.

The more likely scenario IF there was a fox as all was it was confiscated due to not having an import license. Then they will sign it over to someone who does have an import license to do as they wish with(though they then have to pay fees and such for it).

If any zoo got a rescued shipment of domesticated fox it would make news. I guarantee you. There's no secrecy clause in taking them and the zoo sure would play it up as they would be a draw. So I'm sure there never was a fox.

I am really sorry it played out this way. Many would have loved to get one too if it had worked out.

If you do get a cashiers check etc. as said get it checked out but then you need to wait at least a month before spending it. I've heard of the bank teller saying it looked legit then the person spends the money and it comes back as fake later, then YOU owe the money for cashing a back check and spending it. It's crummy on top of an already crummy situation but it's how they do things.
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Re: Sibfox

Postby zebrafox » Sun Oct 30, 2011 6:55 pm

Thank you for the hoobly link, the kens exotic suggestion, and the cashiers check advice.

I begged enough that the Alex guy at Sibfox says he's going to forward my request to his manager... So we'll see if they let me know what port they were shipped to.. Then I'm going to contact the port and get the story. If he doesn't tell me, Im going to call all the ports that are used for importing/exporting and try to track him down that way.

I wrote an email to Ken's Exotics to see, if I cant ever find Viktor, if he can help me import one directly from the Institute. If he can't, I will be looking to adopt an American fox.

I am pretty sure this is a cashiers check. So, how does that work exactly? Say I cashed it tomorrow - and the money goes into my account. It can still turn out to be a bad check? How? I dont know how this works sorry and I WAS planning on cashing it tomorrow when it arrives so yes, Im glad you guys said something.

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